A second Civil War or American Revolution?

It is interesting as I travel through my everyday life and talk to acquaintances or meet with vendors as part of my job the things people say. These folks do not know my political leanings nor my concern for troubled times ahead. These are just regular people that they themselves voice concern about the future. More than once I have heard things such as:

“Something is coming. I don’t know what but something is coming.”

“It is about time that people stand up and take back our country. It’s just a matter of time.”

“There’s going to be another Civil War and this time the South will win!”

From the last one you can tell I live in the South.

These feelings are widespread among many and I feel them too. The division in this country is significant. This division has divided the American populace when it comes to religion, race, abortion, economics, and social concepts. The country is even divided on which bathroom someone is to use. It’s crazy.

I can’t predict the future no matter how hard I try. For arguments sake let’s say things don’t get better they in fact get much, much worse. I know – it’s a stretch. Will we experience some form of Civil War, a second American Revolution – or something else?

 

Civil War

Generally a civil war is between two or more groups within a country or a region fighting to gain control or create change.  Governmental forces are usually involved and to what extent can vary. Looking at the United States why would a civil war be fought? A civil war could be fought over race, political strife and beliefs, removal of entitlements, social classes, economic division, and of course religion.

The United States as of this writing is extremely divided politically with much of the country sitting on opposite ends of the opinion spectrum on many issues. Many believe a civil war could occur between Patriots and “Tea-baggers” on one side and Socialist Progressives on the other. Others believe a race war of sorts may break out and drag in other groups into the conflict.

 

Second American Revolution

A revolution usually involves the overthrow of a government by a segment of the country’s population.

I most often see references to a Second American Revolution in regards to an overbearing government which is continuing to restrict freedoms and admonish the Constitution. The foundational beliefs concerning the Federal government and its tyrannical grip on its citizen run so deep that talk of state succession is not uncommon and widely supported.

The 2nd Amendment is often the subject that brings talk of revolution when Progressive gun control advocates call for government intervention.

 

Checking out a few forum threads over at SurvivalistBoards I came across the following entries on the matter:

“I don’t really see any armed resistance. I view AmeriKa now much like the movie Idiocracy. We are gradually and steadily being converted into non-thinking, dumbed down, complicit, politically correct zombies that will “tolerate” mediocrity, incompetence and even injustice. When people don’t have the brains to evaluate and vote for good candidates, why would you expect them to rebel against completely incompetent ones.”

 

“There won’t be any revolution or civil war per say. There will be just a steady downhill spiral into a police state that enforces the policies of the ruling party. Pretty much what we have going on right now, only getting worse by the year..”

 

“Every country, dynasty and empire has failed in history and been replaced by another.”

“It is nearing the time where we will all have a choice to make, and I for one am getting a little sick of just being an armchair commando and bitching about everything. I’m not inviting insurrection here, I just don’t know what the hell to do other than wait for our government to kill itself.”

“Maybe here sooner than we thought now.”

“If there were to be a legitimate armed revolution, the leaders of such a revolution will be folks who were initially leaders in the military and LE. Think about how many leaders of the American Revolution served and/or fought for the crown before they became disillusioned with it.”

“As some have stated, it won’t happen as long as people are fed and they have things to lose.”

“I’m still of the belief that one or more states will vote to secede first. How the federal government reacts to that will determine whether or not a civil war takes place.”

 

Opinions are all over the place and generally saying that civil war/revolution is possible however it is years away.

I tend to agree with the quote above stating that as long as people have food to eat and stuff to lose things won’t change much although history may paint a different picture. Less than 10% of the population fought in the civil war suggesting a small population can insight war/revolution. How about the American Revolution against Great Britain? 3 percent.

American Reformation: Likely a combination of civil war and revolution is the American Reformation. If you have read the book series 299 Days I envision something similar. The Reformation would include aspects of civil war with infighting between segments of civilians as well as groups included in an anti-government Patriot movement. A slow steady decline in economic freedoms and viability with a steady rise in governmental intrusion and division in the country. Sound familiar?

Thoughts?

Rourke

 

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26 Comments

  1. Oren says:

    Keep an eye on Texas. At least that’s my opinion. When Texas votes to secede, the Federal government will attempt to move in and impose martial law. Won’t work. Too many armed Texans. This skirmish will precipitate the next civil war, or war of independence. It will be a bloody affair. The new independent states will have to go to gold and silver for currency until a currency (gold or silver certificate) is established. The border states will be in a state of flux for many years with the former federal government constantly attempting to retake the seceded states. With the exception of the very liberal cesspools located on the west coast, I would envision the former United States consisting of only a portion of the upper Midwest (Wisconsin thru Ohio) and the Northeast with some of the Middle Atlantic states. Considering how the federal government has raped the Western states and Plains, I’d imagine all of them as well as the historic South to leave the Union. Then let the federal government wither on the vine and stew in it’s putrescent juices.
    This is just an opinion. I feel the blame, all of the blame, lies at the feet of Congress. They were voted in to protect the country from this mess. As Clint Eastwood stated, and he was spot on….”Congress is just a bunch of lazy bastards”. I think I would have added “spineless” right after the word “lazy” in the statement.

    Here’s some of the so called Congressional oversight that really rankles me and many others….this was sent to me by one of the guys I used to work with. Some of the numbers I wonder about.

    “Someone please tell me what the HELL’s wrong with
    All the people that run this country!!!!!!
    Both Democrats and Republicans
    Say, “We’re broke”
    And can’t help our own,

    Seniors,
    Veterans,
    Orphans,
    Homeless,
    Etc.,?????
    But,
    over the last several years THEY have provided direct cash aid to….
    Hamas – $351 M,
    Libya- $1.45 B,
    Egypt- $397 M,
    Mexico- $622 M,
    Russia- $380 M,
    Haiti- $1.4 B,
    Jordan- $463 M,
    Kenya- $816 M,
    Sudan- $870 M,
    Nigeria- $456 M,
    Uganda- $451 M,
    Congo- $359 M,
    Ethiopia- $981 M,
    Pakistan- $2 B,
    South Africa- $566 M,
    Senegal- $698 M,
    Mozambique- $404 M,
    Zambia- $331 M,
    Kazakhstan- $304 M,
    Iraq- $1.08 B,
    Tanzania- $554 M,
    …with literally Billions of Dollars and they still hate
    us!!!!
    But on the other hand, Our
    retired seniors, Living on a ‘fixed income,’
    Receive NO aid!
    Nor do they get any breaks, while our government and religious organizations will pour
    Hundreds of Billions Of
    $$$$$$’sand Tons of Food to Foreign Countries!
    Someone needs to explain to them that
    Charity begins AT HOME!!!
    And another atrocity….
    We have Hundreds of adoptable American Children who are shoved aside
    to make room for the adoption of Foreign Orphans.
    AMERICA: A country where we have
    Countless Homeless without shelter,
    Children going to bed hungry,
    Elderly going without needed medication
    and the Mentally ill without treatment — etc.
    YET……….
    They will have a ‘Benefit’ Show
    For the people of Haiti , on 12
    TV Stations;
    Ships and planes lining up with food, water, tents
    clothes, bedding, doctors and medical supplies.
    Now Just Imagine if Our own *GOVERNMENT*
    Gave ‘US’ the same
    support they give to foreign countries.
    One of the things at the top of Trump’s list. They’re scared silly of him and worried their gravy train will be gone if they allow him to be elected! I’m not a fan of his mouth, but his opponent is already part of the problem and hasn’t done anything about it, and Won’t.”

    But, no. I’m not upset at the direction our once great country is heading. Yeah, right!

    1. goingray58 says:

      Well that is in a book for sure .. Texas I mean .. It’s likely to wind up in regional segments.. Loyalists and Federalists .. liberals whatever being a large portion of the north east to mid west and down to somewhere above the Mason Dixon line.

      The remainder eventually in 3 or 4 regions working as alliances with separate governments.. I’m not sure we will ever function as one whole government again with greatly divided regional ideoloigies. Upset .. sure.

  2. JohnP says:

    Oren, well said and thanks for those figures. I believe this administration is try to ferment some kind of violent shake up is the country and then will invoke some form of martial law with Washington being the seat of power. The DC area can be put under marshal law and the use of federal troops is authorized and may only spread from there through the whole country. About a year and half ago at a town hall meeting with our congressman I told him of my concerns and that if Texas seceded from the union and FL did not I was moving.

    1. Oren says:

      Amen John. I have friends in the Austin area as well as Houston. If South Carolina doesn’t make a move, I’ll be heading for Texas also.

  3. John Gault says:

    To paraphrase John F. Kennedy, if the aristocrats make peaceful and necessary change impossible, they will make violent resistance inevitable. It’s not a war they can win, but if it’s a war they are too foolish and arrogant to avoid, bring it on.

    1. Oren says:

      John Gault, there in is the problem. The aristocrats. I have long contended that this country fought a revolution to rid itself of the aristocracy in England. Now we have allowed the same to be established here. It seems to me the same argument abounds today.

  4. Capt.Michaels says:

    I do not claim to be a prophet or some great all knowing person. If I was…pfft..all the stupid mistakes I made would have never happened. However, I have been gifted with a strong since of discernment and I can see things so far ahead people ask me if I’m day dreaming when I mention the things I see. For all the bad choices, part of which, NOT taking heed to what I was seeing. I am now. Several years ago I could see that Texas would might be the likely catalyst.

    I envision almost identical to what Oren said. The short of it would be like this. Federal Government tries to enforce something and Texas says hell no. For example:

    http://www.ontopmag.com/article/23234/Texas_AG_Ken_Paxton_Tells_Schools_To_Ignore_Federal_Guidance_On_Transgender_Bathroom_Use

    The Feds might try to force something else, Texas says take a hike, Feds say do this or face penalties. Texas still says no, Feds say do this…or else. Texas says…or else. Then the Feds give a dead line and Texas still says no! From there it could set off.

    I have a good friend who’s parents live in another state. His parent’s property has all the natural resources he would need to survive SHTF. Water, land, trees, fully grown fruit trees, and solitude. When I asked him if he would go there if/when it happens. He said, “No. This is the best place to be when it happens. There is no other place I would rather be than standing side-by-side other Patriots.”

    I agree. Which is also why I moved here years ago. You can better believe if/when it hits the fan. Texas will close and secure it’s borders. I want to be here NOW, not after to face the struggle to get in and or set up.

    Other people have rightfully so mentioned concerns South of the border. Let me summarize that concern and any future concern. Paid with the precious price of life and blood. The question of whether or not Texas will make it was settled years ago by the Remembering of the Alamo.

    Therefore, if I go and if I must. I will! Where I go or will be sent. I don’t know, but I will do it under my own two legs and my own free will. I will not go quietly or go period to Auschwitz.

  5. JBernDrApt says:

    Praying it doesn’t happen but like Capt Michaels I feel it will. Something takes the U.S.A. out to be not able or willing to protect Israel, according to the Scripture. Feel it could be just this. Obama seems to have set the stage to divide us racially, politically, economically, socially and every other way possibly and we are a powder keg. And yes, Texas could be the match that sets it off. We must always be prepared. Powder dry. knife sharp and larder full. That is all. – Keep Looking UP

  6. yooper says:

    well,as i see it, ” my father in heaven” put me in the upper Mid-west for a good reason. Here in Canadian P, to help my fellow men and women. There is a war coming and all states will be in it. It may start in one state but will quickly spread to all states. I`ve been waiting for this to happen since Vietnam. OOORAH

  7. LibertysTeeth says:

    My wife, daughter, son-in-law, grandsons and I moved to Tennessee from Ohio three years ago,(thank God!).We all live on twenty three acres now, and all pitch in getting our homes and property ready for whatever might come. It’s been hard, but gratifying , and have a long way to go. Anyone out there from TN? What do you think Tennessee might do? Was wondering (hoping) if they’ll follow Texas? I have family in Texas. Everyone take care and be safe.

    1. Fred C says:

      I am originally from Tennessee but live in GA now. If all of TN was like East TN where I am from I would say “yes, they would stand with TX”. Unfortunately there is middle TN and West TN and I don’t know about them. Those Hillbillies in East TN may form their own state!

      1. goingray58 says:

        Fred C.. well sir .. I am in West TN .. about as west as you can be and not be an Arkansan. Memphis will not stand for anything but itself .. never has except in the distant past. I work there and drive a long time to get to the outskirts.. We’ll be ok . .Rest assured there are many rural Tennesseans that are just as independent and know how to eat what they grow, catch or kill. we be all right. guess we’ll see won’t we .. For me I worry about get home and pack for it every day .. My alt BOL is 6.5 hours … at interstate speeds.. I have an invite or two that I might prevail upon if I can bring my support for family .. as a friend here says “I will never be a refugee. It never ends well for them” .. and he would know better than I would.
        Yup timing is a big deal .. premature and it costs you .. to late and it can cost you huge .. as in not getting out or worse..
        Readiness is probably the key some graduated load and assembly if we are uncomfortable so the go button just means get in and drive .. not start thinking about leaving and what to pack .. that whole wanting it to be other than it is gets in my way at times.. and I waste time

  8. goingray58 says:

    Every organism evolves .. from the petri dish up .. and it is usually around division of resources .. So I guess i have accepted it … anyway regional governments will be likely but only after much conflict with the power people trying very hard to keep their own stash so to speak. Green helmets for “order” and when that breaks down blue helmets . At that point we will have lost control and it devolves from passive resistance, to not so passive rebellion, to revolution.. Not so much civil war except it will be American against coerced loyalists who feel they have no choice.. Once blue helmets are here (as a result of failing economy and borrowing from the IMF to fund a failed state and war.. etc.. ) we will have lost control.

    Then’s the revolution. Nothing unites different opinions like a common enemy that neither like. Leaders will rise .. they always do.. And we will take it back.. no other nearly failed or failed state can afford to put enough manpower on the ground to control it.. blow it up maybe but not control it.. and there is no economic gain in that.

    Toward the end of the revolutionary part of the timeline comes the reformation, and in my opinion the trickier part. Pulling the US back together either wholly or regionally will take tough men and women with similar ideals. Strong leaders will be needed, like once we had. The alternative if that fails is regional warlords and constant conflict.. see the Balkans, So Africa, So. East Asia 2 decades ago etc etc..

    What comes out of the reformation done well is a leaner independent more self sufficient North America or whatever we call it.. But not likely in our life times or maybe just. Not unlike the Early US really with So West, No West, South and No East.. but different because reclamation and expansion are different. Expansion is resource rich and new/exciting and reformation is resource poor and more hard work and sacrifice than fun. After extended conflict MORE sacrifice will NOT be popular.

    Note my story in no way says anything about how ugly it could be getting there.. Real conflict and the absence of law and order are always very bad and innocent people get caught up. I doubt there will be one unaffected family, or one sole who will not appreciate freedom regained and what it cost to regain it. Not unlike our first revolution. Except this would be to gain back what was lost .. so Reformation. You can have what you can take, and you can keep it if you work for it, but in as much as anyone is here it’d be done again in 200 years more or less..

    Those that do not pay for something or earned it but are but given it, cannot do what is necessary to keep it because like now they are about there ease, and normalcy bias stays or binds their hands. Leadership becomes bureaucrats and autocrats Rome, Greece, Europe etc etc managing the herd.

    I just don’t think things that have motivated people have changed much since time began or civilization at least. Pray like it depends on God and work like it depends on us and all you can do is all you can do. Faith and Work..
    Be diligent Be deliberate
    GG58

    1. 3rdMan says:

      Do not think you will have to ever worry about blue helmet troops. The only thing they have ever successfully done was to get taken hostage in countries they were deployed too!!! The criminal gangs would be the real threat!

      1. goingray58 says:

        Depends on head count …
        Our primary lenders are either Japan or China. China definite has Imperial ambitions. re: building islands where none exists to control more of the SCS. If or maybe when we cannot meet the borrowing terms of our primary lenders and no one wants to BUY our bonds, we will only have the IMF to borrow from. The IMF will put sever constraints on the loan like any secondary lender would, that would include more than our WORD that we would pay it back on time. At that point we would already have proved that to be untrue. It is more than likely those would include direct administrative control of the assets used to secure the loan. That is boots on ground locations. The IMF’s enforcement branch are requested and provisioned through the UN Security Council. That is done by requesting those boots. I don’t think the Primary lenders will have a problem with that. Soooo .. You could likely expect Soviet block military and possibly GRU folks as well as CHICOM and Japanese(possible)… As a loan condition we will lose some self determination, and likely limited decision making over terms of enforcement.. and you can bet that will be disarming the resistance either proactively through planning or retro-actively over some threat real or perceived.
        So if you mean to say Blue helmets re not a problem.. If it goes there I beg to differ.
        Professional soldiers of almost any stripe have better experience, tools and toys than civilians can manage.
        If the presence is token and we are not borrowing IMF.. then yu are probably quite correct, until someone goes cowboy and gets loud at least..

        1. 3rdMan says:

          We have Veto power on the UN security council. As far as professional soldiers that is pretty much limited to Western nations. Most other nation’s troops are poorly trained conscripts and poorly equipped. So, yep not really concerned about them. “Blue helmets” is nothing more than the new boogie man!!! Without the U.S. funding and backing the IMF would fold as well. The reason we can spend like drunken sailor is because the U.S. dollar is the reserve currency. The day that ends is the day we fall!!!

  9. Fred C says:

    A subject a while back was about “when” do you make your move to Bug Out if you are not Bugging In. The discussion today makes that even more of a guess as to when to make your move since these events would take place rather slowly. I have about 80 miles to travel to the Bug Out location so I have to be very deliberate making a decision. I wish we could move there now but that isn’t possible. Thanks for all the thoughts/insight today.

    1. Oren says:

      Fred C, I just wish there were some way all preppers could get a heads up or a red flag or something from others who see the time is right to get out of Dodge. I put more credence in websites such as this than any other. Watching the “news” of a night is a comedy. I feel like I am a participant in the novel “1984” absorbing the latest from “Big Brother” whenever I watch it. It is truly the “party line” coming at you.

      1. Capt.Michaels says:

        Hmmm…good point. The first problem would be saying “who” gets to call “Red dog”. (Used by the military to alert or initiate man down response due to being overrun or “blitzed”) Derived from football. Don’t want any over zealous person crying wolf continually.
        I guess text by phone would be the easiest, followed by email, and then well a post on the boards you visit. Something like Red Dog! Red Dog! Followed by nothing else…not even comment saying goodbye heh.

        We’ve discussed at length what triggers will happen to start a bug out. Perhaps a refresh?

      2. JR says:

        That is a tough one Oren as different regions may receive a different effect from even the same “event”. I remember back in 2008 Rawles over at SurvivalBlog put out a statement just prior to the government bailing out the banks and corporations. His post basically said get things in order that the time to institute “plans” was close at hand. Well – obviously the stock market didn’t crash nor the financial system so it never went further. A lot of people were waiting on his word.

      3. goingray58 says:

        JR .. true .. the effects will differ by region.. Probably the indicators regardless of how close to the epicenter you are are the same..
        Oh I think Rawles was in order by saying have things in order.. because we just know indicators.. not whether it will go further or recede.
        Let one or two foreign banks deny US dollars a a reserve currency and it’s on .. but at what speed?

        I’m pretty sure financial indicators are one of the best things to watch .. It is the surest form of confidence or lack of it in a government.. baring something lime EMP/CMP/Invasion, but even then there will be financial signs. You can’t believe anything the majority of leadership.. more like you can be sure whatever they say is based on whatever is best for them.
        IMO .. get ready to go and cycle as needed to refresh. I’d like to be able to go in a half hour..
        Of course where I am is not a city .. so by the time I need to go.. I’m not sure there will be many places to got to.. I can think of 2. I have fair resources and one major security risk .. several minor ones.. If I go i’ll be late I expect due to my location. Good or bad.

        Anyway.. If financial stuff goes south the devaluation of the currency will be one of the first casualties. The money guys will look for safe havens.. That is metals for many so you can look to Silver and gold and the ration of how many ounces of which equals the other .. I have an app on my phone and follow with alerts. The general conditions of banks and foreclosures would precede it.
        Follow it an set your sites on a level or measure you are comfortable with and don’ exceed it.

        I think there is an important distinction here.. You should be out of debt before then. You should have a plan to immediately move your 1’s and 0’s out of banks in a heart beat.. you can put em back if needed.
        Part of your plan is how to pay ahead your property taxes for years in advance.. One of the major losses in the crash of 20 was farms being repossessed or paid pennies on the dollar because farmers could not pay a few hundred in property tax. Take a look at the government owned land map. most of that land was given as grants for settlement .. then taken back. We invested sweat and blood and they reaped. Truth.
        Write checks .. notarize copy and send. You’ll use funny money to pay for OLD amounts, not inflated amounts.. paper isn’t that quick.
        Access to money will be one of the first casualties,, they will have access but you will not. You should already have invested in metal or some assets that can be used as money // paper money will be useless (again there is little risk as you can always convert it back to 1’s and 0’s by selling it).
        All that happens well before you hit the BO button..

        just think about your situation and have a plan.. credit is bad even if you have no choice.
        IMO
        Done preaching.. sorry
        GG58

  10. LibertysTeeth says:

    Thanks “Fred C.” & “goingray58”, I’m glad to hear that, I’m in South East TN. I’m so glad I got my family out of northern Ohio. Most people up there will just roll over and take whatever comes or agree with it.

  11. Panhandle Rancher says:

    In the words of that patriot Davy Crockett, “you may all go to hell and I will go to Texas.” As a native Texan, I choose to leave but still maintain Texas domicile. Never discount the Lone Star State and long live the RoT!
    Panhandle Rancher

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